javadoc

E85 - Anyone Try it?

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So we had a dyno day today, and my AFRs were beyond pig rich. The mixture pegged 10:1 by 4000 rpm and never rose above it again. Needless to say, I'm running rich. The guys at the shop are true believers in getting power out of E85, and have some very powerful cars running on it. Anyway, the thinking is that it takes 30% more fuel to run on E85... and I'm obviously not running out of fuel delivery capacity if I'm somewhere beyond 10:1 AFRs. So, their theory is that running a percentage of E85 will bring the air-fuel mixture into line, and improve power.

Has anyone tried this? I'm starting with 25% mixture of E85 and 91, and will be data logging the AFRs and other items to see if it improves my AFRs. The 'butt-dyno' says that the car has more power after I filled up tonight... we'll see.

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I don't see why it wouldn't work but a few cautions with ethanol. #1 you are going to get more cyl wash down so oil changes are needed more often- obviously you are running a % so it won't really be an issue if someone is running 100% or a large % this is something to keep in mind.

#2 Ethanol, in any percentage, eats the rust, sediment, etc off the insides of the gas stations tanks, your fuel tank/lines, etc. You will want to change your fuel filter after you do this the first few times and a little more often after that to keep from having issues. A lot of people with older cars really had issues when we went to the 10% ethanol blend here, especially if they have metal fuel tanks, just from this reason.

I think it's a pretty clever I'd and am curious as to how yours will dyno out.

Nick

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I don't see why it wouldn't work but a few cautions with ethanol. #1 you are going to get more cyl wash down so oil changes are needed more often- obviously you are running a % so it won't really be an issue if someone is running 100% or a large % this is something to keep in mind.

#2 Ethanol, in any percentage, eats the rust, sediment, etc off the insides of the gas stations tanks, your fuel tank/lines, etc. You will want to change your fuel filter after you do this the first few times and a little more often after that to keep from having issues. A lot of people with older cars really had issues when we went to the 10% ethanol blend here, especially if they have metal fuel tanks, just from this reason.

I think it's a pretty clever I'd and am curious as to how yours will dyno out.

Nick

Yup, I'm going to change the fuel filter after a couple of tanks just to be conservative.

I went to Home Depot this morning, and it was a bit easier to break all four tires loose than usual. It did take a bit for the ECU to adapt. I ran a data log and at WOT, I'm still over 10:1 with 22psi of boost... sheez, how much fuel do the green injectors flow again??? :D

Where's that guy with that new Saleen when I need him?

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With a proper tune and and fuel control, E85 can make some serious power on a turbo vehicle. There are a number of down sides you should be aware of: I am not sure if all the fuel pump internals, lines, filters, and injectors are compatible with E85 and replacements could be costly. Trying to tune your cars A/F ratios by mixing fuels is a very imprecise and can be a dangerous method so proceed with caution. In addition, a number of users have found the quality of E85 can vary between stations and fill ups. They are seeing between E80-E90 depending on station and day of the week! E85 is a slower burning fuel and requires more advance timing for optimal performance but your ECU will not be able to correct for this. Expect 30% less MPG on each gallon of E85 you add.

Doug H

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What's this mythical creature that you are speaking of... this fuel economy creature? :D Thanks for the information, I'm proceeding with caution.

I am also looking at doing maybe an LS1 in my truck, running on E85... but that's a whole other animal. :)

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What's this mythical creature that you are speaking of... this fuel economy creature? :) Thanks for the information, I'm proceeding with caution.

I am also looking at doing maybe an LS1 in my truck, running on E85... but that's a whole other animal. :)

This is what a 3.0L twin Turbo Mitsubishi did on E90, 770 AWHP and 670 AWTQ is not too shabby! He needed two fuel pumps and six 1000cc injectors to get enough fuel in the motor :D :

E90_770AWHP.jpg

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Super nice. You do need capacity in your injectors, that's for sure.

We had a guy here run 488whp/501tq out of a 16valve B23 motor yesterday, on E85. Just crazy.

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He's right about being compatible with injectors and such...I've even seen some of ford's flex fuel vehicles have issues. We tried it in a 3.0L FFV ranger and it ended up taking out all six injectors over a period of several weeks. What we were told by ford was if it was run on it since new and fairly often it wasn't an issue but on older vehicles that never had ran it before it was an issue due to it "cleaning" the fuel system and depositing the trash in other areas.

Nick

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My dealer said not great

Your dealer also works on stock cars and would not advise someone to do something that could potentially have issues.....

No one has missed out on the fact that the fuel system may have issues with not being compatable, as far as the engine not running on it would be a different story. If he's got the time and funds to try it and see what happens more power to him. We all aren't interested in having stock vehicles.

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Been running E85 for over a year in my volvo and my bike for 3-4 years. Really good stuff for the money. If anyone has questions they can PM me. I have 750cc injectors for the record.

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Update: Aside from blasting off an intercooler hose (probably unrelated... more related to running 22psi of boost, and it's 40F outside), the car is a total BEAST now. Seriously. It is intoxicatingly fast, and I'm still pegging AFRs in the low 10s. So, I'll try a bit more mix on the next tank. :)

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Been running E85 for over a year in my volvo and my bike for 3-4 years. Really good stuff for the money. If anyone has questions they can PM me. I have 750cc injectors for the record.

96 Volvo 850 GLT

99 Volvo V70R GT3071R

03 Suzuki Turbocharged Hayabusa, 347HP from 1300cc on motor without spray.

93 Mazda RX7 LS1 V8, adding 2 holset HX35s turbos over winter.

96 Buick Century 452k miles, still strong. Tarp top convertible. 1 of 1 for sale

92 Astro Van LS1 V8 swapped(sold)

Wow... you, arguably, win the title for V70R owner with the most diverse collection of sister vehicles.. 347HP 'busa ? :)

Be sure to add your rides to our Registry.. :(

Rob

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Wow... you, arguably, win the title for V70R owner with the most diverse collection of sister vehicles.. 347HP 'busa ? :rolleyes:

Be sure to add your rides to our Registry.. :)

Rob

I have not even dynoed the busa with the bigger turbo. That was 2 years ago.

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So, are signs of a clogged fuel filter things like, the car won't idle, or it stumbles badly, then stalls? Just curious. <_<

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So, are signs of a clogged fuel filter things like, the car won't idle, or it stumbles badly, then stalls? Just curious. <_<

Could be...could also be trash in the injectors that got past the filter.

Nick

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Could be...could also be trash in the injectors that got past the filter.

Nick

Where's the filter on the awd cars? Of course, it's like 30F outside, and my garage is filled with crap from the basement. @%(!

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Where's the filter on the awd cars? Of course, it's like 30F outside, and my garage is filled with crap from the basement. @%(!

I did mine about a year ago and am having a brain fart..I think it's mounted right behind the rear suspension towards the passenger side but don't quote me on that.

Nick

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I did mine about a year ago and am having a brain fart..I think it's mounted right behind the rear suspension towards the passenger side but don't quote me on that.

Nick

Sounds about right. Mounted in a bracket on the chassis.

Doug H

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I did mine about a year ago and am having a brain fart..I think it's mounted right behind the rear suspension towards the passenger side but don't quote me on that.

Nick

I did it about a year and half ago on mine. I think its actually sort of in front and on top of the rear suspension. You have to access it through a panel in the tailgate. Its right behind the rear passanger seat. Its a bit of a PITA but its only a half hour or so job. The hardest part was figuring out how to get the forward most tailgate panel off. If i remember correctly you have to undue everything from the opening then drop it down from the bottom. Don't exactly remember if you had to get to the mounting bolts from the bottom though. Oh and its kind of a tight space so small hands help. <_<

Joe

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Where's the filter on the awd cars? Of course, it's like 30F outside, and my garage is filled with crap from the basement. @%(!

A clogged fuel filter will show up on highest fuel demands like WOT. Ussually it wont be enough to feel a miss but just a lack of power.

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Sounds about right. Mounted in a bracket on the chassis.

Doug H

Found. Thanks both of you.. it's just too cold outside... so it's one more day of driving the truck to work, and it's 8mpg fuel economy. :P

A clogged fuel filter will show up on highest fuel demands like WOT. Ussually it wont be enough to feel a miss but just a lack of power.

Hmmm, wonder what else it could be then.

I did it about a year and half ago on mine. I think its actually sort of in front and on top of the rear suspension. You have to access it through a panel in the tailgate. Its right behind the rear passanger seat. Its a bit of a PITA but its only a half hour or so job. The hardest part was figuring out how to get the forward most tailgate panel off. If i remember correctly you have to undue everything from the opening then drop it down from the bottom. Don't exactly remember if you had to get to the mounting bolts from the bottom though. Oh and its kind of a tight space so small hands help. ;)

Joe

The '98s are supposed to be total PITAs, but the '00s are not supposed to be that rotten to get off. Well at least according to my indy-mechanic.

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Found. Thanks both of you.. it's just too cold outside... so it's one more day of driving the truck to work, and it's 8mpg fuel economy. ;)

Hmmm, wonder what else it could be then.

The '98s are supposed to be total PITAs, but the '00s are not supposed to be that rotten to get off. Well at least according to my indy-mechanic.

Could be bad plugs and wires or yes a bad injector. Any ses light?

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Could be bad plugs and wires or yes a bad injector. Any ses light?

Nope, no light. I still have to try the fuel filter... just in case it's that simple.

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